A New Home for My Blog

I have moved my blogging activity to a new location, and I'm still blogging about False Prophet Ronald Weinland.
Click the link for an easy transfer.

This Blogspot remains as an archive covering the period of April, 2008 through early July, 2009.

Wednesday, July 8, 2009

Ronald Weinland on Governance in Y2K

Way back in time, just after Y2K was not the disaster it was prophesied to be, there was yet another episode of turmoil in Weinland, Inc.

During the WCG break up after Joe Sr's infamous sermon in Atlanta and repeated a week later at the Big Sandy campus, Ronnie resigned in March of 1995 and incorporated the following month as the United Church of God of Toledo, Inc. Back then, the "spirit of Indianapolis" was alive and ex-WCG members were promised that the new organization would be different when it came to governance, and would work with local church boards. Hence UCG-AIA (an international ASSOCIATION). But after a few years, the "spirit of Indianapolis" soon went by the wayside and I suspect there are few if any independent local boards associated with UCGdom.

Back to Ron's story. Weinland joined up with UCG in '95. Then he thundered about financial misappropriations in UCG in an email sent to other UCG elders at the end of 1996 and possibly in a letter as well sent during the first few days of 1997. After campaigning on the issue for several more months, he resigned from UCG in May of 1997, taking most of his Toledo congregation with him. The associated corporation was retitled as "The Church of God, Inc." The local congregation continued on, with church members voting as members of the corporation to hire Weinland as their pastor. But Weinland was expanding his horizon beyond Toledo and the surrounding region accessible in a day trip. One of the members started a small web site for the church. Sermon tapes were sent to those outside the Toledo area who requested them. In January of 1998, he published the first issue of "Newswatch" which was published intermittently over the next several years.

As a result of Ron's outreach program, he managed to attract as his own followers some of the WCG ex-members ("the scattering") from other areas. These followers included Johnny Harrell and others in Georgia, and also more from other areas such as Texas. Tithes continued to be collected by the corporation governed by a local lay board, and is reported to have accumulated to around $300,000 by early 2000. Ron began to feel an ownership of the members outside the Toledo area. He began hinting that the tithes from out-of-town members should be handled separately.

Matters came to a head between Weinland and members of the board at a meeting held on Saturday evening, January 22, 2000, right after Weinland finished a sermon series entitled "Spiritual Idolatry". Weinland wanted to spend some of that tithe money on a 4-color brochure, of printing quality just like the literature his spiritual idol Herbert Armstrong sent out, to attract yet more from "the scattering". The lay board was less convinced and Weinland left the meeting under somewhat less than calm demeanor. There was a continuation meeting the following Tuesday at which the conflict continued.

On January 29, 2000, Weinland delivered a nearly-3-hour sermon entitled "Am I Following Jesus Christ?" which was later distributed on not one but two cassette tapes. He started the sermon by explaining that it would be one of the most important sermon he'd given in years, and that he had to deliver a long message in a single session because of the timing and this would also be one of the hardest sermons he'd ever given. He canceled a trip to Lubbock, Texas to stay in Toledo to address the problem.

Ron claimed that he had almost resigned in response to an email he had received the night before, but was hanging in there (he was not going to Steamboat Springs to make his living building port-a-potties for his brother Steven after all). The crisis could split the congregation, but that was OK. He didn't care about the money and could start all over again, but was taking a principled stand for continuing to do what he was doing.

Ron said that he would send out the tapes from this sermon -- he would not be a hypocrite by hiding his group's problems after criticizing those of other groups.

During the sermon he played with the member's emotions. He talked about the elderly shut-ins "helped" by his tape program. A few minutes later, he sighs and said "You know there's some wrong spirit in here today, brethren. And it's not God's. There's some pride and haughtiness, I wish some individuals could have a camera looking at their face." I wish I had a videotape of Ron's face as he delivered this sermon, claiming that he loved them all, very deeply.

After a 10-minute break to allow time to switch cassette tapes, he again confronted his congregation by asking "am I saying something wrong, reading people's expressions?" He claimed that he was not chewing out the board, and has respect for them.

A year earlier he had sent a letter to board members Gary Klar and Terry Wrozek stating that he was not comfortable with out-of-area tithe funds being under local control. He stated they were sitting on a great deal of money, and wanted to have a glossy booklet to send out. He proposed a second corporation to handle out-of-town funds, because after all those funds exceeded those generated by the local group in the Toledo area.

Ron repented of reusing the bylaws which he copied from someone else, explaining that they were not Godly. He presented new draft bylaws to be voted on by the members a couple of weeks later, on February 12, as a replacement of the existing bylaws. Under the new Godly bylaws, members of the church would no longer be members of the corporation. That burden would be removed from them and only members of the corporation would be "leading elder" Ronald Weinland as the first chairman and a board of elders. Elders chosen by ---- Ronald Weinland. As an aside, the restrictions for the building fund would be changed to allow spending it to rent facilities. No word on the size of the building fund, but this proviso would allow it to be depleted as it would be spent for those ongoing expenses. This would free other funds for other purposes. I can't say if there is any relation, but 5 years later Weinland had his own building fund, purchasing a $381,000 home in northern Kentucky and putting enough money down that if he had a mortgage the holder did not require that he pay property taxes into escrow.

The sermon ended with his then favorite elder Terry Wrozek leading a song. After which Weinland himself gave the closing prayer, not risking someone else providing a different take on the sermon.

In another post, I will be discussing what happened the week following this sermon.

Note: I've allowed the discussion in the comments to the last few posts kind of ramble off-topic -- with a couple of Weinland's followers participating it's been rather informative. While I'll continue to allow some latitude in the comments to those other posts, Sheriff Mike is in town on this thread. Let's keep the comments for this post on topic, which is Weinland's governance methods in general.


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Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

Thanks, Dill Weed. You've confirmed my impression of Ron's "prophesy" on unemployment -- it was a report, not a prophesy. Guess we've got the same ears to hear without the extra ears to "hear" stuff that wasn't actually said.

WO: I've found the HWA searchable library to be a valuable resource in my research. And have corresponded with the webmaster, who seems like an amiable fellow.

As far as your issue with PDF files, I'm afraid you'll have to sort it out for yourself. I'm mystified as to why you have a problem with them, as Adobe has gone out of their way to make reading of PDF files available to the masses. PDF files nowadays are almost as ubiquitous as ASCII text files as far as being able to read them.

Weinland Observer said...

Mike, I have PDF 7 and the files were created with an earlier version. Do you have PDF 7 or greater?

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

I'm running Acrobat Reader version 8 and have no issues.

Dill Weed said...

Latest version of Abode Acrobat


Dill Weed

Dill Weed said...


You are being strung along. Given in little pieces and can't be released officially until later or not to be given until it happens or until God gives more.

This is the language of deception and delay. The prophecy is soon going to be fulfilled, it is just around the corner, nearer now than ever before, don't let your guard down, don't let doubt creep in, stay strong in the faith, don't be decieved. Then the coup de grace - that you can only undertand if God grants it. I suppose that would be OK if he were speaking a language no one else understood.

Consider, they are God's witnesses, would God have them come and give a witness no one could understand?

You don't have to answer. I'd rather you didn't actually.

Weinland Observer said...

Adobi 9.0 installed. 1936 article not found. Reader works, but will have to sort out why text comes out as jumble. Wish me luck!
Some interesting bits to that last sermon for all, no matter the kind of ears. If swine flue closes the Feast sites, it will be very severe by then.
Ron's story was interesting. Any comments?

Kirrily XPKG said...


Dear oh me - I'm going to come accross as an idiot here, but did GTA prophesy as well? I didn't realise that other COG's actually propheised (I do know of one at the moment who is doing it - came up with the second timeline before Ron - won't mention him, I don't believe him either). I know, I'm coming off pretty naive here aren't I :-)

I have never resesearched any other COG really, apart from being in GTA (XHWA - I did have the same experience in GTA - joined in 2002 I think? - the end is IMINENT etc.

One of our members was always looking at the news, particularly for events concerning a 'cornerstone' in the 'Holy Place' (BTW - Ron raves on all the time about Jerusalum not being Holy - yet the Bible calls it Holy A LOT).

Anyway, I can recall GTA saying that his Dad had a lot 'wrong' and how upsetting it was when he married his second wife, and how devesting it was with HWA threw GTA out. GTA also said that HWA took the credit for a LOT of stuff that GTA himself actually wrote.

When I was in GTA (where I first learned the 'truths') I couldn't put any of the booklets down - just gorged myself on the stuff.

I had never had an experience like it.

I was brought up a Seventh Day Adventist (so Sabbath was nothing new) but other beliefs of traditional christianty where a SHOCK.

Anyway, I cried and cried and cried when GTA died. He baptised me on a trip to Australia - and I never will forget how lovely he was to me.

I heard all the other stuff about him later (but because I loved him I ignored all that - boy, I'm good at doing that hey!).

I must say, the most painful relegious experience I have ever had was in the pentecostal churches. Ron Weinland PALES in comparison to their junk - I REALLY REALLY mean that. I didn't know what pain was until I was in there.

To be fair, I was married to a pentecostal pastors son at the time, and my new 'truths' went down like a lead balloon! So I am sure all reading this can understand where most of my pain came from.

I'm all together off ANY relegion now.

I would rather an antheist as a friend than any type of 'christian' any day.

Did I wake up on the wrong side of the bed? ;-)

HWA - boy, I really feel stupid for not doing more research into PKG before I 'joined'. One of the other members told me just at the beginning that he Googled Ron, and nothing bad came up about him.

That's all the "research" I did! I was in, hook, line and sinker.

*sigh* - My conclusion: Jesus will come back whenever he is ready. I will live my life, obey what I know to the best of my ability. I am going to live my life now to it's fullest. I hope to have a child. I will raise that child to the best of my ability, and be the best person I can be. When Jesus DOES come back, I guess then I will know the truth - repent, and live how He wants me too.

If that is wrong after all I have TRIED to do, well, I just can't do anymore. It will kill me otherwise - seriously.

What more could God ask of a person?

None of this is HIS fault, it is mine.

I do really wonder though, as Mike mentions - why don't the warnings in Deut. happen to all these false prophets?

I just don't understand. Somtimes in my darker times, I wonder if any of it is true at all.

Mmmmmm - maybe I will convert to Jedi! (I do love Star Wars, and Ewen McGregor wouldn't be too bad as my God he he he!!).

Kirrily XPKG said...

Dill Weed said:

"This is the language of deception and delay. The prophecy is soon going to be fulfilled, it is just around the corner, nearer now than ever before, don't let your guard down, don't let doubt creep in, stay strong in the faith, don't be decieved. Then the coup de grace - that you can only undertand if God grants it. I suppose that would be OK if he were speaking a language no one else understood".

That is EXACTLY, PRECISELY my experience. It's enough to drive a person insane.

Dill Weed said...

The only things worse is trying to reach someone captivated by it.

Dill Weed

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

Perhaps xHWA made a typo. I suspect he was referring to the June/July 1934 issue of the Plain Truth downloadable from this page. The 1934 issue has a prophetic timeline.

I also have met Garner Ted, but much longer ago than you. I hope your baptism was chaperoned ;) But probably by his 70's he tamed down.

GTA's own web site has this page which indicates he continued to talk prophecy even after his break with daddy Herb. But I doubt anywhere near what Ron does.

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

HWA - boy, I really feel stupid for not doing more research into PKG before I 'joined'. One of the other members told me just at the beginning that he Googled Ron, and nothing bad came up about him.

Don't feel bad. There wasn't that much about Weinland on the Internet before late in 2007. Ambassador Watch had a post mocking Ron's release of 2008 GFW, and Thielogical Bob had a post prior to that.

Things began to change when Ron ramped up his spending on Google ads after the 2007 FoT, and by early in 2008 as the first timeline approached the discussion increased.

Weinland Observer said...

Mike, I managed to open the file but it comes out as jumble. It says it's because the document is untagged. Could you email me the text of that June-July 1934 article, copy and paste it in to a message?

J said...

Perhaps it's a sign, WO. ;)

todd said...

i meant to tell you this sooner, but please look up the word prophesy in the dictionary.

xHWA said...

WO -- here you be. Read these two sites:

This will give you all the Plain Truth Magazine you can stomach, and then some:


And here are two more I think you may get some value from because the info is already summarized for you:



xHWA said...

"Perhaps xHWA made a typo. I suspect he was referring to the June/July 1934 issue"

Did I put 1936?? Typo confirmed! I did mean 1934. d'oh! So very sorry about that.

I was thinking of 1936 as being important to the timeline, but wanting to write 1934 because that's the edition I was referring to.

xHWA said...

K: "Dear oh me - I'm going to come accross as an idiot here, but did GTA prophesy as well? I didn't realise that other COG's actually propheise"

Oh, Kirrily, don't feel overly bad. I was caught in the exact same trap as you. You got out, that's what MATTERS!!! :)

To answer you, yes. Garner Ted was the main voice of the WCG for decades. He is just as responsible for many of the WCG teachings as Herbert W. is. But prophecy is the mainstay of all COG groups. They all do it.

You see, William Miller started the whole ball rolling back in the 1840's. After that Ellen G. White pulled the false prophecy line. Then A. N. Dugger and G. G. Rupert of the COG7. Then Herbert W. Armstrong. I say that to emphasize there is a long tradition of false prophecy in the COGs, and that has been passed on to the likes of Ron Weinland et al. It's a formula. A formula that works! $$$$$ *cha-ching*

It's not about prophecy, you must understand, but fear. Wonder about some new interpretation reels you in but fear motivated by the doom and gloom prophecies keeps the sheep in line and paying. All the COGs do it. I can think of one and only one COG group that has de-emphasized it.

But chin up, dear. IMHO you're doing the right thing by not blaming God, going back to basics, and trying to be the best person you can. Mistakes and being deceived are a fact of life. What you do with what you've learned is what distinguishes the wise from the fool.

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