A New Home for My Blog

I have moved my blogging activity to a new location, and I'm still blogging about False Prophet Ronald Weinland.
Click the link for an easy transfer.

This Blogspot remains as an archive covering the period of April, 2008 through early July, 2009.

Sunday, February 8, 2009

Who Are You Going to Believe, Me or Your Lying Eyes?

Note: Dennis Diehl has written a humorous post that captures the essence of Weinland's foolishness.

False Prophet Ronald Weinland was in Bloomington IL this weekend. He read a letter from his Australian evangelist Wayne Matthews which proof-texted the 3rd thunder describing the drought in Australia. While the fires there are certainly significant to those affected and should not be minimized, they should not be elevated to an event of biblical proportion. Wayne took time to mention that "no one died" as a result of the fast in Australia, which is certainly good news. I hope that's also true for the PKG members in the US, New Zealand, Canada, the UK, Belgium, the Netherlands, and anywhere else that there are ensnared followers of this false prophet. Ron went on to read selected news articles with unemployment statistics to support his 4th thunder. There's still no mention of dead ministers relative to his 5th thunder nor any mention of the other 2 phases of his 5th thunder. And nothing on the other thunders which Weinland presumptuously defined.

Reference was made again to Mike A (Washtay) who was described as a 3-year member (now disfellowshipped) who camouflaged his true feelings. I didn't get the impression from Washtay's emails that Washtay is part of the "scattering" (ex-WCG). Perhaps he was recruited by reading Weinland's first book "Prophesied End Time". Three years ago is about the time Ron claimed to be an End-Time Witness (Dec 17, 2005) and also put out his origin of Christ doctrine at the 2005 Feast of Tabernacles. At another point in his sermon Ron mentioned being blamed for a member's family problems, etc. I didn't see anything of that sort mentioned in the emails Washtay shared. So perhaps there's et another exiting member besides Washtay. And there maybe yet another exiting member given Ron's mention of his $381,000 home which was not referred to by Washtay. In fact, Washtay seemed willing to take on blame for whatever failings he had without transferring them to Ron. The problem for Ron was that Washtay wasn't willing to take on the blame for Ron's failings as well. I invite Mike (Washtay) to share to the extent he is comfortable his experiences as a COG-PKG member in comments here on this blog.

Weinland's theme and sermon title related to his commission, of which he has none. Reference was made to a January 1972 "Good News" writeup by Herbert Armstrong on his commission (which he also did not have). I looked at the Jan/Feb 1972 "Good News" and didn't see any article or personal by HWA inside it. Perhaps Ron can clarify, maybe it was a simple misstatement. Co-worker letter maybe? For those uninitiated in things-Armstrong, the "Good News" was a magazine sent out by HWA's WCG only to WCG members.

Ron finally dared to read Deuteronomy 18:20-22 but claimed that it didn't really apply in his case. Let's review Deuteronomy 18:

But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die.

21 And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the LORD hath not spoken?

22 When a prophet speaketh in the name of the LORD, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.

So Ron would have you believe what he prophesied is true yet ignore when he prophesied that it would become true. Let's review for example what he said in his Dec 15, 2007 interview with Daniel Ott on "The Edge" radio program. At the beginning of the program, Daniel asks Ron if he is a "direct and ordered prophet of God". Weinland answers in the affirmative: "that is true". So everything Ron says during the entire interview is speaking in the name of God. Toward the end of the interview, Ron makes his statement that the USA would be "so far down the tubes" by last month that we wouldn't be able to inaugurate a president. Sorry Ron. The "thing" you prophesied includes not only the "what", but also the "when". During the interview, Ron promised to return to explain the failures of his prophecies, but that didn't happen. Daniel had something to say about that. Seems that Ron refused a reinterview back in July and Daniel Ott properly characterized him as a fraud. Not only is Ron a false prophet, but he doesn't keep his word. No wonder that the IRS is investigating him.

Ron went on to blather in his sermon that everything he stated in his radio interview was correct other than that the timing was changed by 8 months with the 50th truth. Somehow the "6-month marginal window for events" mentioned on the last page of "2008 God's Final Witness" morphed into "6 to 9 months" before settling on the approximately 8 month difference between his first and second timeline.

For his first timeline, Ron predicted "nukular" explosions 45 to 90 days after he "began his job" as a Witness at the 1260 day point (April 17, 2008) or by mid-July. In this his second timeline, he "rebegan his job" on December 14. Forty-five days after that was Jan. 28, and 90 days after that is this coming March 14. Also in his "Three More Weeks" sermon on March 29, he issued his "If by Pentecost" declaration in which he promised to stop preaching if evidence of the First Trumpet (destruction of vegetation and animals) was not clearly evident by Pentecost, which was less than 45 days later. So far we see no widespread destruction of plants and animals, but Ron would have you believe that our economic woes fulfills this since printed money happens to be green. The US currency does happen to be green -- is that the case in all the scattered nations of modern day Israel? (UK, Australia, Canada, and others.) It's been awhile since I traveled internationally, but as I recall foreign currency is a rainbow of colors.

Despite the obvious failures, Weinland maintains that he still a prophet of God. For a follower, it all hinges on whether you believe that Ron Weinland truly speaks for God. What evidence of that has he offered? Only his failed prophecies. The test that he defined for himself in his book, the deaths of 5 specific ministers, has not materialized. Not even in part, even though the first minister Ron predicted to die (Rod Meredith) is about 80 years old and has suffered a stroke.

Regarding Ron's attempt to disconnect himself from the "when" of his failed prophecies, where's the time limit? Otherwise, everything he's said will probably come true in the future, though probably not at the same time. Cataclysmic comets have struck the earth in the past, and may again in the future -- thousands or millions of years in the future. Ron, let's draw a definite line in the sand. Oh, scratch that -- you already have.

And then we have Ron's death curse against his critics and mockers who were to speedily die from the inside. His death curse obviously, clearly, includes yours truly. This is the 50th day since he reissued his fatwah, and despite that you see this post. So much for speedily. Those who still believe him are those who believed him initially and "threw down their pitchers" by handing over their life savings to him and breaking family ties with those who didn't follow them into Ron's PKG money pit to finance his prophetic delusions and his country club home. Also still believing him are those who were attracted by his Google ad campaign and are of an apocalyptic mindset.

I hope that Ron's followers will soon open their eyes to clearly see reality and depart from this false prophet before yet more damage is done. And that they will also ignore Weinland's mind-gaming characterization of anyone who dares to think for himself as a sinner. However, I expect that they will follow him into the 51st "truth" whatever that turns out to be and will also follow him into his 3rd timeline.


For the Truth said...

You people (bloggers against Ron W.) just don't get it. You don't have God's spirit dwelling in you so you will never get it. It's a vicious cycle that you just can't seem to break away from. Why don't you just quit while you think you're ahead? Moreover, it's God you hate not Ron. It's all about God, not Ron. God is using Ron in His way not the way you think in your natural, selfish, carnal human mind. Everytime you talk about Ron, it should be replaced with God because it's God you fight against. It's God's one true way of life you hate. You fight and resist God. The way God is using Ron in this end-time is making all of you look like chickens running around with your heads cut off. It's truly funny and sad at the same time. You truly are the blind leading the blind.

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

to "For the Truth"

Thank you for the chuckle. At the same time, "no thanks". I'm dismayed by your thinking.

Actually, what we hate is what Ron is doing to the duped including yourself. It's quite true that we "don't get it". Just like a social disease.

It's quite telling that you equate Ron with God. As far as desperate chickens with their heads cut off, Ron's sermon of Feb 7 fills this quite exactly, as he desperately tries to explain his failed prophecies.

My eyes are wide open. As far as the blind following the blind, it's you following false prophet Ron following his own insane delusions.

I hope that your eyes are soon opened to see reality.

Todaysfate said...

Hello. Just a few words from the "apocalyptic mindset".

This country and in fact the bulk of the rest of the world is right now, right at this moment for lack of a more articulated description.... "F--KED".

"For The Truth" ... There is no reason for you, nor Ron W to continue to point out that it’s all because people can't live God's "one true way of life". That's obvious. That is why we are where we are at. And no-one believes it, nor cares anymore. We are living Satans way of life now. The fact is ... we are ALL blind ... and it's clear that not one of us truly wants to "lead" anything other than to the extent that it brings a paycheck.

But .... None of this has much to do with (or without) Ron W.

Everyone and on every subject ... including Ron W. Including the anti- Ron W. community, including congress, Bush, Obama, and the kings and dictators of the world, including teachers, students, and parents, managers and subordinates have completely and utterly forgotten how to deal with any kind of problem besides simply talking about it while it just gets worse and worse.

The point of this mindless rant is that GOD is using every last one of us and not just Ron W. We have failed. And not comes the wrath. (as designed).

For those who don't believe in God, wrath, or any of that type of thing. Ok ... the news is ... the world is still "f-ed" and it's not beause of a little book called the Bible. So what now?

The problem is bigger, MUCH MUCH bigger than Ron W. The cause is whole of humanity.

Sorry bout that. I thought I would try to appear to be the most irrational post here. You know... to lighten the mood a little.

Nice to see you again Mike.

Anonymous said...

Ron certainly didn't disappoint Mike A, (Washtray) as he announced his lack of understanding and being of the wrong mindset. Ron declared that Mike was disfellowshipped. Ron had to get the last word.

The most interesting part of the sermon was the part where Ron was discussing Deut 18, concerning false prophets and these verses do not pertain to him. According to Ron, (he hesitates for a few moments in his sermon as he reads from Deut. 18:20-22, then states that "timing doesn't count." Ron, I beg to differ! Ron, this isn't baseball where you get 3 strikes. Eventually, you either hit the ball and run or sit down and you’re out. So far, you have not hit the ball, you have had more than your fair share of strikes and now you are arguing with the umpire for one more try!

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

Actually TodaysFate, your comment is not the most irrational, and I think I agree with your main point.

We may well be in for economic hard times not experienced before except by those who lived during the depression. But not because of God's wrath or Weinland's 4th Thunder. But rather due to our own incompetent leadership as exemplified by the last occupant of the White House. I hope the present one does better but so far am not impressed.

xHWA said...

RW would just say what his mentor and twin said:
"Christ ... has BOUND in heaven what His Church, even in unrealized error, has bound in earth."
-Herbert Armstrong, Ministerial Bulletin, "re: Pentecost and facial make-up", 12/3/74

Pay attention to the "even in unrealized error" part. Or... did he say that already?
Well, at any rate, then comes the blame and misdirection.

"They began by 'questioning' this, that and the other doctrine.... SATAN is the real author of this rebellion against God's Work."
"This thing is of SATAN...these deceived men [are] now allowing Satan to turn them the wrong way."
-Herbert Armstrong, Letter to the members of the W.C.G., 2/25/74

Even RW questioned and teaches against HWA's doctrines. It was Satan then, but God now? Not possible.

And not to overlook the occasional friendly warning from a future former Weinland follower:
"You people... just don't get it. You don't have God's spirit dwelling in you so you will never get it."
-For the Truth, right up there.

Oh, how very many times did I say that same sort of thing over the decades? That exact same sort of thing.
Poor, For the Truth. I know that the thought of you being no better than anyone else is hard to accept, but when you're ready we'l be here to help you out. No hard feelings.

But Anonymous is 100% correct.. timing counts. Unfortunately for RW, it's not just about timing. Like Mike said, there are specific times and events that are wrong, ergo DEU. 18 applies. Buuut....
Exactly as HWA went to his grave unchanged and unrepentant, so will RW go.

For the Truth said...

To Mike
Just like I thought. It's all about Ron and not God. You have a Ron W. fetish or something. That's scary. You think people like me are being "duped" by what God is giving Ron? Have you ever heard of a little thing called faith? Without faith it is impossible to please God? All your reasoning and logic means nothing because you can't discern the spiritual without God's spirit dwelling in you. So of course, it will all seem like nonsense and lunacy to you and others with your same mind-set. As for me when you said "I hope that your eyes are soon opened to see reality", to you I say, I wouldn't hold your breath.

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

To "For the Truth":

I've actually concluded a good deal of what you've said concerning your mind set. No -- I'm not holding my breath or expecting the PKGers to suddenly wake up and smell the coffee.

I'm just wondering how far your faith in Ron will carry you. How far can you go, how many "truths" and timeline changes will you accept before the "evidence of things not seen" falls flat?

No, you're not duped by what God is giving Ron. Because Ron is not getting anything from God. But you are being duped -- by Ronald Eugene Weinland and his end-time fantasies.

jack635 said...

For the Truth:

"Everytime you talk about Ron, it should be replaced with God because it's God you fight against."

So you think Ron is God? Or because you think Ron is an agent or representative of God, then God dwells within Ron, therefore God is in Ron? If I told you something was definitely going to happen on Wednesday, and it did not come to pass in any way, would I have told you the truth or would I be a liar? The bible which Ron professes to know so much about says God is not a liar and scripture cannot be broken.

<"You think people like me are being "duped" by what God is giving Ron?"

The only thing God has given Ronald Weinland is the bible. Anyone who reads the bible can understand it if you read it word for word. No one needs another person to interpret the bible for them. Why would an all powerful loving god leave an instruction book that could not be understood by a common man?

The bible also warns readers about those who will lead you away from the truth in the bible by twisting the words to make you think you are not enlightened enough to understand what is written, without guidance from an annointed important person.

When the blindfold is removed from Ronald Weinland's sheep, and they get to see the truth, of course they become angry and defensive. They do not wish to appear foolishly deceived. They will cling to any hope that what they believed is surely the truth and they are just experiencing a bump in the road.

I find it satisfying to read the emails of Washtay and Weinland. One more person has had his eyes opened and ears unstopped, so he can see the truth. I know there will be many more. How many will be following Ronald Weinland five years from now? What excuses will Ron have as he continues to preach "the end is near".

But he has his truths from god, so stop saving for a rainy day and send your money in because "it will be worthless". Wasn't our money supposed to be worthless in the latter part of 2008?

Excellent work Mike. Your blog is saving people from organised crime.

Anonymous said...

Always remember, Ron is in the middle of the word wRONg.

Anonymous said...

My mother is a member of PKG, and she also equates Ron = God. It's really sad.

The way she sees it, if Ron is wrong, then there is no God.

She's also as condescending as "For the Truth", so I guess it must be a member trait.

Anonymous said...

Ron's a liar and all his members are hypocrites. They claim they follow God, but they are merely following the teachings of a man, who plainly speaks lies and convinces people to believe him. Classic case of the blind leading the blind.
You could just as easily replace Ron wherever the Bible talks about a fool and you would be reading the Bible correctly.

angel said...

For the Truth,

No, you’re not – for the truth. You’re for Ron. You’re right, though, we don’t have Ron’s spirit dwelling within us.

The day I quit believing God’s (not Ron’s) word is the day you can accuse me of hating Him: “When a prophet speaks in the name of the LORD, if the thing does not happen or come to pass, that is the thing which the LORD has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him.” Does this verse say “timing doesn’t count”? No. It doesn’t. If you can’t see that, then you’re the one who’s blind, following a blind man.

We’ll make you a deal, we’ll quit when Ron does.

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

She's also as condescending as "For the Truth", so I guess it must be a member trait.

Ron and his followers are proud to be humble.

We’ll make you a deal, we’ll quit when Ron does.

Hear, Hear Angel.

If Ron had been true to his word that he issued in his "If by Pentecost" declaration, I would have quit blogging. There wouldn't be pictures of Ron's house on the Internet. His IRS woes wouldn't have received the exposure they have.

Anonymous said...

Sounds like the only real critic of Ron Weinland left is Mike and the Don't Drink The Flavor Aid blog. The rest don't care because, well, Ron is wRONg.
He won't have any more persecution, nor die in the streets of Jerusalem, because he is a false prophet.
This has now become just a cafeteria school fight between the Bully (Ronald Weinland) and one blogger (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid).
Yes, this is the man for the end times folks. Ron is such the prophet that nothing he has said in the name of God has happened. It's 2009, what's happened to your debt and mortgage? It doesn't matter what Ronald Weinland says, your finances are your finances. You are accountable, even if your leader is a tax evading con-man.

Stephanie said...

"For the Truth".......Oh My, I remember saying the exact same thing to my husband, who is obviously more "grounded" than I! You want so desperatley to believe in "something". I do get that. Unfortunetly,it's not RW! Try believeing in yourself! Were we all made in God's image? What are you afraid of?

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

Anon 3:21

I have to disagree with you. There are other blogs linked from this site that criticize Weinland actively. As well as others that do so occasionally.

And I take exception to characterizing this as a "cafeteria fight". While Weinland is a bully, those whom he bullies would be the first to attack me. I have no illusions that my arguments are persuasive to the average PKGer who can't remember what Ron said past last Saturday's sermon and think that he speaks for God despite the lack of evidence for that and all the evidence to the contrary.

As far as your comments regarding finances, it's hard to follow quite what you're saying. But I'll agree if you're saying that we individually and collectively are responsible for our economic woes, and not the result of anything that Ron and his PKGers have prayed for.

jack635 said...

"It's 2009, what's happened to your debt and mortgage?"

Ronald Weinland told us not to hold on to our 401K, savings and investments, and even gold. He said "it will be worthless".

Your debt and mortgage are not worthless. The money you owe on your debts may be worth a lot more now than you anticipated.
Ronald Weinland has ruined lives....and futures.

angel said...

This is how pitiful Ron's followers are; over on The Weinland Witness, "carmel" asks about Ron changing his timeline, wondering why he is predicting dates if he's not sure. "think-differently", Ron's champion defender, promptly refers carmel to the COG-PKG site with the admonition to be humble and repent, then God will open carmel's mind to the truth.

"sojourner" asks if it is true that Ron predicted no new president would be inaugurated, and if so, how did he not speak misinformation. "south africa 28" jumps in and refers sojourner to the COG-PKG website, saying find the answer to the question yourself, you need to work for it, salvation is not going to be given to you on a plate. This prompted some comments about salvation that effectively changed the subject.

No answer was given to these people who had honest questions, instead they are told to find the answer themselves, on Ron's website (not the Bible), to humble themselves, and to repent.

How very, very sad.

Anonymous said...

"The way she sees it, if Ron is wrong, then there is no God."

Wow. Sounds like when PKG finally implodes, it's gonna be 1994 all over again.......

Anonymous said...

"The money you owe on your debts may be worth a lot more now than you anticipated."

Or a lot less. The interest rates on my debt has gone down between 4 and 8%, in some cases. It's great, I can pay off the principle even faster this way. Even my credit card rate went down two points! 8-O

I daresay I'm not the only one benefiting from the economic "meltdown" in this way.

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

"The way she sees it, if Ron is wrong, then there is no God."

Ron may end up creating more atheists than Christians.

jack635 said...

Sorry PH.
What I meant to convey was the debts are now worth more because they expected those mortgages they took out to be un-collectable. They now have to pay those debts and mortgages they thought they would not have to pay off due to the U.S. no longer existing.

Ron's position: sorry no refunds.

Vaughn W said...

Reading "For the Truth's" first comment I laughed and thought that person was joking by using every cliche that I used when I was a PCG member.

One of the hardest parts of accepting the false nature of the COG's is realizing that I am not special and actually have no revealed secrets known only to me and my fellow COGers.

So now instead of laughing with him I am saddened for him (or her.)

PKG or PCG same song different verse.

Babbleon said...

Where in Australia is Ron's Church based?

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

Weinland's church is based in Cincinnati, Ohio, USA.

Babbleon said...

Sorry, I didn't make myself very clear.
Where is Wayne Matthews preaching for cog-pkg in Australia?

Mike (Don't Drink the Flavor Aid) said...

Wayne Matthews seldom preaches. When he does, his location is not advertised.